*Times indicated refer to Web version of audio

(01:02) Islam, Second Largest Religion in the World
Islam ranks second to Christianity in the number of adherents. Global estimates vary between 900 million to 1.4 billion followers of Islam. Most estimates number the worldwide Muslim population at 1.2 billion. Indonesia is the most populous Muslim country with more than 1.7 million followers.

(01:47–02:46) Music Element
"The Multiples of One" from Awakening, performed by Joseph Curiale

(02:00) Krista's Muslim Conversation Partners Since 9/11
Over the past five years, Krista has interviewed Muslims from a range of backgrounds and ideas. Following are links to Speaking of Faith programs with Muslim guests:

» The Face of the Prophet: Cartoons and Chasm — Vincent Cornell
» The Meaning of Faith — Omid Safi
» Muslim Women and Other Misunderstandings — Leila Ahmed
» The Other Religious America in Election 2004 — Muqtedar Khan
» A Perspective on Islam in Iraq — Ahmed H al-Rahim
» The Power of Fundamentalism — Khaled Abou El Fadl
» The Problem of Evil — Rami Nashashibi
» Progressive Islam in America — Kecia Ali, Omid Safi, Michael Wolfe, and Rasheeda Muhammad
» Religion and Our World in Crisis — Khaled Abou El Fadl
» Religious Passion, Pluralism, and the Young — Eboo Patel
» Serving Country, Serving Allah — Abdul-Rasheed Muhammad
» The Spiritual Fallout of 9/11 — Ingrid Mattson
» The Spirit of Islam — Omid Safi, Seemi Ghazi
» Two Narratives: Reflections on the Israeli-Palestinian Present — Mohammed Abu-Nimer, Sami Adwan
» Violence and Crisis in Islam — Vincent Cornell
» Women, Marriage, and Religion — Kecia Ali

(02:55) Actualities of Previous Muslim Guests
Omid Safi in the 2001 program, "Progressive Islam in America":

You still hear from a lot of people, 'Why aren't the moderate Muslims speaking out?' And, you know, at some level you just — you feel like, I've lost my voice from speaking out.

Leila Ahmed from the 2005 program, "Muslim Women and Other Misunderstandings":

I get constantly called and asked to explain why Islam oppresses women; I have never yet been asked, 'Why is it that Islam has produced seven women prime ministers or heads of state and Europe only two or three?' or whatever it is.

Vincent Cornell from the September 2004 program, "Violence and Crisis in Islam":

We're faced with this crisis where we have now become The Problem, you know, capital T, capital P… The microscope is focused on us, and we are now forced to take stock of what we as a community have done to ourselves.

(03:55–04:57) Music Element
"Fezâ" from The Ottoman Heritage, performed by Ensemble Kudsi Erguner

(04:45) Nasr in Cairo on September 11, 2001
On September 11, 2001, Seyyed Hossein Nasr was in Cairo, Egypt. Listen to the complete version of his observations (mp3, 3:28) of the reactions of the Egyptian people.

(06:17) Verses of the Qur'an
Nasr cites an oft-quoted Arabic phrase, Subhan Allah, which commonly translates to mean "All glory to Allah" or "Praise be to Allah." Arabic scholars note that the root of subhan means to praise or glorify, but it refers to being fully immersed or swimming in something that is beyond humankind's comprehension — sometimes strange and wonderful, sometimes powerful and dangerous.

(08:36) Muslims and the Colonial Experience
The process of European colonization of the Middle East can be traced back to the days of the Roman Empire. The history of European penetration is gradual and complex, but it often began with the need for trade and then the establishment of outposts. Christian missionary work was used as an effective tool for assimilating Arab cultures. Colonization of the Middle East, India, and northern Africa took place in waves, with an identifiable turning point beginning in the 19th century. Beginning in the 1820s, Great Britain had gained a foothold in the regions of the Arabian Gulf and France soon followed with occupation of Algeria; both controlled key seaports on the Red Sea at that time. Later, France would take control of Tunisia, Great Britain seized Egypt by 1882, and Italy took over Libya in 1911. British missionaries also began proselytizing in Lebanon and Syria during this period.

World War I brought about a different phase of European colonialism in the Middle East. The Ottoman Empire chose to side with Germany and the Axis powers. Great Britain brokered a deal with the Arabs that led them to revolt against Turkish forces for economic aid and the promise of independence. But the British and the French ultimately partitioned the Arab dominions for themselves: Britain presided over Palestine, Iraq, and what was then known as Transjordan, and France had domain over Syria and Lebanon. Egypt gained independence from direct British control in 1922.

With World War II, many countries in the Middle East, including Syria and Lebanon, came under direct colonial control of Great Britain. Not until 1944 did these two nations gain their independence with the support of the United States and the Soviet Union. Meanwhile, the British, who still held influence in Egypt, rallied against King Farouk I, who initially sided with the Axis powers. Germany's defeat resulted in greater British intervention until Egypt declared itself a republic in 1952.

Iran, which was also pro-German, was jointly occupied by Great Britain and the Soviet Union. The country functioned as the main supply line during the war. A 1942 treaty signed by officials from the three governments provided for the two Allied powers to leave Iran six months after the end of the war. The Soviet Union failed to fully comply and required Iran to commit to large oil concessions. Near the end of World War II, the United States advanced its fossil fuel interests in the Middle East — including Iran, Iraq, and Saudi Arabia. The U.S. would not support direct colonial control but would play an influential role in supporting regimes that furthered its strategic interests.

Before the Second World War, more than two-fifths of the globe and a third of the world's population fell under foreign control in the form of colonies, territories, dependencies, or dominions. By the 1990s, 200 new independent nations had been created. Many rank among the poorest, most underdeveloped, and war-torn countries in the contemporary world.

(12:02–13:01) Music Element
"Ollin Arageed" from Eclipse, performed by Hamza El Din

(12:19) Interview with Khaled Abou El Fadl
In order to understand the anger of young Muslim suicide bombers, Krista spoke with Khaled Abou El Fadl in early 2002. A professor of law at UCLA and a global human rights activist, El Fadl had a narrow escape from Islamic fundamentalism as a teenager growing up in Egypt. Following is an excerpt of their conversation from the program "The Power of Fundamentalism":

As an Egyptian, it becomes very concrete when you think everywhere you turn the — the identity to which you belong is confronted with military defeats. If you travel — you carry an Egyptian passport and you try to travel all around the world, you become thrown into a category of the inferior just by virtue of the fact that you belong to an Arab identity.

And I remember, you know, going through a stage where I tried the — the sort of cool route of being Westernized. That, for me, didn't work, and what did work was that — that exultation, intoxication, remarkable high of finding a group of people that tell you, 'You know what? You're better than the Americans. You're better than the British. You're better than the Arabs. You're better than the church. You're better than anyone because you're Muslim and all you have to do is just simply accept our version of orthodoxy.'

And I remember, as a teenager, suddenly I would walk around with my head high. I belonged to something very powerful. And I could see the world as black and white, evil and good, and I was on the side — in fact, not on — just on the side of good. Fortunately, I grew out of it. Unfortunately, many of these kids never get that chance.

(13:53–14:51) Music Element
"Ollin Arageed" from Eclipse, performed by Hamza El Din

(15:35) Burning of Foggy Bottom in the 1960s
Riots occurred in 30 U.S. cities after the murder of Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. on April 4, 1968. The riots resulted in burning, looting, and shootings in cities with large, African-American populations such as Detroit, Chicago, and Washington, D.C. The D.C. riots lasted three days and involved crowds of up to 20,000 people. Lyndon Johnson called out the National Guard. At one point, crowds came within two blocks of the White House. In the end, 12 people were killed, more than 1,000 injured and 6,000 arrested. More than 1,200 buildings were burned, including 900 businesses.

(17:44) Queen as Head of Anglican Church
The Church of England became the established church in England during the Protestant Reformation after King Henry VIII severed ties with the Roman Catholic papacy because the pope would not annul his marriage to Catherine of Aragon. The Anglican church has been a distinct entity since its settlement under Queen Elizabeth I. The church maintains much of Roman Catholicism's traditional framework while incorporating the spirit and fundamentals of Reformation faith as expressed in the Book of Common prayer. Some elements preserved include its church government and liturgical celebration. The queen of England is formally considered the Supreme Governor of the Church of England; in practice, the church is governed by the General Synod under the authority of the British Parliament.

For an in-depth and probing discussion about the relationship of church and state in the United States, listen to the Speaking of Faith program, "Religious Liberty in America: The Legacy of Church and State." Krista speaks with Charles Haynes about his work with the American public school system, Philip Hamburger regarding his research into the surprising origins of the principle of separation of church and state, and Cheryl Crazy Bull about the loss and reemergence of religious expression in tribal public life.

(20:06) Analogy of Mother Theresa
Mother Teresa (1910–1997) was a Macedonian nun who is known for her compassionate care for the indigent and dying in Calcutta, India. She established her own order, "The Missionaries of Charity," in 1950. It has spread to more than 40 countries. She received the Nobel Peace Prize in 1979.

(21:59–22:54) Music Element
"Mwashah" from Eclipse, performed by Hamza El Din

(22:37) 2001 Conversation with Omid Safi
Krista's conversation with Omid Safi took place in 2001 and was included in the program, "Progressive Islam in America":

If you go back 50 years and you listen to what the liberal Muslims were saying, essentially it was idolizing modernity and saying that, you know, 'We want to be as Western as possible, as modernized as possible, as scientific, rational, technological as possible because that's what the Europeans are like.' …and I think what has happened with this emergence of the group that we're calling progressive Muslims is that we are exposing modernity to the same kind of critique that we are doing to our own tradition. It's to say that there are incredibly powerful and profound things that take place in modernity, such as, you know, the rise of scientific development and notions of democracy and human rights, but that these same developments also have a very dark and nasty underbelly.

And I think that, you know, the absolute environmental destruction that we have inflicted upon the world in a way that has never existed before, the legacy of colonialism — I mean, what is, after all, 19th century and, you know, much of 20th century about other than colonizing 85 percent of the world? So modernity cannot, for us, be this entirely wholesome package that we must somehow download. And it's that sense of grudgingly engaging both our own tradition and modernity to find the best elements of both that I think is new.

(23:43–26:57) Music Element
"Salatun Fi Sirri Wa Gahri" from Earth…Peace, performed by Mohamed Mounir

(27:06–28:30) Music Element
"Bismillah ar-Rahman" from Oceans of Remembrance, performed by Oruç Güvenç and Tümata

(28:14) Krista's Conversation with Chaplain Major Abdul-Rasheed Muhammad
Of the estimated six million Muslims residing in the United States today. African Americans account for more than one-third. To gain a greater understanding of these Americans, Project MAPS: Muslims in American Public Square commissioned the American Muslim Poll (PDF, 139kb). Conducted by Zogby International, the poll results were published in December 2001 and reported on demographics, religious practices, social and political issues, and September 11th and its aftermath.

Major Abdul-Rasheed Muhammad converted from Christianity to Islam as a young man. He later became the first Muslim chaplain in the U.S. Army. Here is an excerpt from Krista's interview with Muhammad as part of "Serving Country, Serving Allah":

There's no real separation between the practice and the beliefs. And the beliefs basically are five basic principles, and that's where it all starts from, you know, belief in one God, Muhammad being his last prophet. Prayer five times a day. The institution of charity, or zakat, which is an annual payment, or, also, a regular series of charity or charitable kinds of actions. Fasting in the month of Ramadan once a year for 29 or 30 days. And making the pilgrimage to Mecca once in a lifetime. Those are the five basic tenets of the religion.

What I would really personally like to see more of is talking more to people in this country who are tax-paying citizens who pray five times a day who are part of organizations, many of whom are professionals. I mean we're not hearing a whole lot from them, but we seem to have this tendency to want to almost associate Islam with people who are extreme in their views. And I don't quite understand that.

(29:18–30:20) Music Element
"Taqsim on the Qanun" from Chants Soufis Arabo-Andalous, performed by Ensemble Ibn Arabi

(29:44) Reference to Sharia Law
The word sharia means "the path to a watering hole." More than a system of criminal justice, sharia law is a religious code for living that is adopted by most Muslims to some degree. This code for living governs all elements of a Muslim's daily life — practices of prayer and fasting, charity and justice. Many Islamic countries, particularly in the Middle East, have adopted particular elements of sharia law, governing areas such as inheritance, banking, and contract law.

In the Speaking of Faith program, "Violence and Crisis in Islam," Muslim scholar Vincent Cornell described the tradition of Islamic jurisprudence as expressed by the related terms of sharia — meaning the "way" or method set out by God — and fiqh — the "understanding" or the practice of this method of understanding. Informed Muslims, Cornell writes, use the term sharia to connote the sacred law as a global ideal, while the word fiqh connotes the evolving interpretation through the schools of jurisprudence.

Fiqh is considered an interpretive science that was first developed in the seventh century. Fiqh is the application of the sharia, the model of the Islamic way of life, to specific cases. Historically, sharia law coupled with the practice of fiqh allows for a multiplicity of views and applications. Listen to Cornell discuss the importance of fiqh. (RealAudio, 1:14)

(32:50) Modus Vivendi
Modus vivendi comes from the Latin, meaning a "method of living." It has come to mean a compromise between adversaries that allows them to peacefully coexist and operate in a shared space.

(33:43–35:46) Music Element
"Ollin Arageed" from Eclipse, performed by Hamza El Din

(33:55) Killing the Innocent Banned in Qur'an
The Qur'an, the holy book of Islam, means "recitation." It is considered to be the verbatim word of God that was revealed to the Prophet Muhammad over a 23-year period during the seventh century CE in Arabia.

The written Qur'an, which is not arranged in chronological order or in a distinct linear narrative, features accounts of Muhammad as well as stories of the earlier prophets including Jesus (Isa), Moses (Musa), and Abraham. A majority of Muslims learn the Qur'an in Arabic and find beauty in its rhythm, composition, and voice. In the introduction to Approaching the Qur'an, Michael Sells describes the power this text holds over contemporary Muslims:

One afternoon in Cairo, I found myself in an unusual situation. The streets of this noisy, bustling city were suddenly strangely quiet, yet the cafes were crowded with people clustered around televisions. For special events—the death of a great figure, an important soccer game—one might expect to find people in cafes following the event on television. What had drawn people from the streets into the cafes today was the appearance of one of Egypt's popular Qur'an reciters. When I returned to my hotel, the lobby was filled with men, some of them Egyptian Christians, watching and listening to the televised recitation with intense interest.

Such appreciation for the recited Qur'an stimulates a diversity of explanations. To devout Muslims, the recited Qur'an is the word of God revealed to the prophet Muhammad; its divine origin accounts for its hold over the listener. Some anti-Islamic missionaries attribute the extraordinary power and beauty of the Qur'an to a Jinni or even Satan. A Marxist revolutionary from an Islamic background, who was highly critical of all religion, insisted that the genius of the Qur'an resulted from Muhammad's alleged madness and resultant close contact with the unconscious. In Middle Eastern societies, what unites these opinions and seems beyond dispute is the fact that the recited Qur'an is a distinctively compelling example of verbal expression.

The written text is commonly identified with its beautiful Arabic calligraphic scripts, which are read from right to left. The calligraphy itself is not merely decorative. It conveys both a spiritual and secular knowledge of Islam and the Muslim culture at large.

In verse 74 of the chapter titled "Al-Kahf" ("The Cave"), the Qur'an expresses contempt for those who are innocently killed. Here are three translations of the verse:

Yusufali
Then they proceeded: until, when they met a young man, he slew him. Moses said: "Hast thou slain an innocent person who had slain none? Truly a foul (unheard of) thing hast thou done!"

Pickthal
So they twain journeyed on till, when they met a lad, he slew him. (Moses) said: What! Hast thou slain an innocent soul who hath slain no man? Verily thou hast done a horrid thing.

Shakir
So they went on until, when they met a boy, he slew him. (Musa) said: Have you slain an innocent person otherwise than for manslaughter? Certainly you have done an evil thing.

(34:58) Conversation with Vincent Cornell
In 2004, as Islamist violence intensified in Iraq and elsewhere, Krista spoke with Vincent Cornell, an American who converted to Islam 30 years ago and is well-respected in global circles of Islamic scholarship. The Muslims who were responsible for 9/11 and who've propagated violence beyond it, Cornell says, practice a "radically superficial" version of that faith. He sees the present as a moment of ferment within Islam — very much like that which preceded and accompanied the Christian reformation. But, this religious turmoil is happening in a borderless world of far more dangerous weapons. Following is an excerpt of Cornell's conversation included in "Violence and Crisis in Islam":

I mean, for myself the Islam that I accepted through the Quran and through now over 30 years of study of classical Islamic works throughout Islamic history is to a large extent not the Islam that I see on TV and being expressed by many people in the Muslim world. The desire for revenge, the desire for glory, the desire for personal heroism, the desire to eliminate all norms of decency and ethical behavior in the cause of a political goal, all of these things that are being expressed by Muslim extremists are specifically mentioned as aspects of pre-Islamic society that Islam came to end and eradicate. And so for Muslims like myself what makes this particular time so painful is that everything is in a sense reversed. The world is upside down. You know, it's a 180-degree reversal.

(36:51) Iran in the Islamic World
The Islamic Republic of Iran, known as Persia until it changed its name in 1935, covers over 600,000 square miles with a population of over 69 million people. More than 50 percent of the population is of Persian heritage and 89 percent are Shia Muslim. Nearly 80 percent of the population can read and write. The country is strategically located on the Persian Gulf and the Caspian Sea, and primarily arid in climate.

(38:54) Nixon in China
President Nixon visited the People's Republic of China for a week in February 1972. He was the first U.S. president to visit China. He met with Chairman Mao Zedong and conducted substantive talks with Communist Party Premier Zhou Enlai. For a provocative and revealing look at the events leading up to Nixon's visit to China, check out "Nixon's China Game" produced by the PBS program, The American Experience.

(39:48–41:07) Music Element
"Taqsim for Violin" from Chants Soufis Arabo-Andalous, performed by Ensemble Ibn Arabi

(40:37) Krista's Conversation with Ingrid Mattson
One year after 9/11, Krista interviewed the Islamic educator Ingrid Mattson of Hartford Seminary. Shortly before 9/11, she became the first woman elected vice president of the Islamic Society of North America. On August 23, 2006, Mattson became its first female president. Here's an excerpt from her interview that appeared in the 2001 program, "The Spiritual Fallout of 9/11":

As she watched the images of planes crashing into the World Trade Center towers and the Pentagon, Mattson feared that all she had worked for had been lost. Krista asked her where she would have non-Muslims look for images dramatic enough to counter those pictures that associated Islam with airplanes crashing into buildings.

Well, you've hit right on it, I mean, that's the point, is that violent actions are much more dramatic and memorable. A person who is motivated, a Muslim who is motivated by faith, will sometimes in their life have an opportunity to do something, you know, grand, but most people don't. Most people, they live out their life, live out their faith, day to day by small actions of generosity, humility, and gratefulness. I think what Americans need to do is look around them and see — many hospitals, for example, that there are many Muslim doctors, and day after day they are serving people, they're helping people.

Certainly it's a result of their training, but it's also an aspect of their faith. There are Muslims working in soup kitchens and in those shelters. So, you won't, you don't necessarily see that drama, because it requires some kind of active outreach, or at least a desire to look for those Muslims on the part of other Americans. But I believe that in the end it's worth it.

(41:49–43:01) Music Element
"Duo'ud — Qanun" from Chants Soufis Arabo-Andalous, performed by Ensemble Ibn Arabi

(45:32) South Asian Population in London
More than two million South Asians currently reside in the United Kingdom, with more than 700,000 living in London and surrounding suburbs. The 2001 Census by the British government revealed that 1.6 million residents of the United Kingdom call themselves Muslim.

(48:17) Polls on U.S. Citizens on Islam
Krista cites a March 22, 2006 survey by the Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life titled "Prospects for Inter-religious Understanding: Will Views Toward Muslims and Islam Follow Historical Trends?" (PDF, 160kb). A majority of Americans express a favorable view of Muslim Americans (55 percent). But, the figure is significantly lower than favorability ratings toward Jews and Catholics, on par with evangelical Christians, and quite a bit higher than views of atheists.

When it comes to Islam and its association with violence, more than one-in-three Americans say that Islam is more likely than other religions to encourage violence among its faithful; over half of evangelical Christians believe this. But the same polls suggest that knowledge of Islam and personal acquaintance with a Muslim have a power to temper this perception. College graduates had a favorability rating of 66 percent as compared to 44 percent of people with a high school education. And, 74 percent of those people who know a Muslim had a positive impression; only 50 percent of those who did not know a Muslim had the same impression.

In a 2006 survey on how Westerners and Muslims see each other around the world, the Pew Global Attitudes Project found that citizens of Europe and the U.S. viewed relations as being generally bad. And, in a 2006 YouGov survey, more than 50 percent of British citizens consider Islam a threat to Western society, up from one-third of respondents polled immediately after the September 11, 2001 attacks.

Looking back, a July 2004 poll about American perceptions of Islam, also sponsored by The Pew Research Center for the People and the Press, found nearly half of U.S. citizens, 46 percent, thought that Islam was more likely to encourage violence, whereas the same question asked in March 2002 found that only 25 percent of Americans believed Islam was more likely than other religions to encourage violence.

(47:39–52:43) Music Element
"Have a Little Faith in Me" from Have a Little Faith, performed by Bill Frisell

(48:54) Past Conversations with Muslim Voices
Seemi Bushra Gazi, a lecturer at the University of British Columbia and a non-clerical reciter of the Qur'an, from "The Spirit of Islam" originally broadcast in October 2001:

And I have to remind myself that the kind of work I do, teaching Arabic at the university or talking or just interacting on a daily level with people and having them have a different experience of Islamic tradition through me, that that subtle work will remain and will continue and will have power sort of beyond any kind of blunt instruments of terror that may seem to be destroying the bridges and closing the gaps where there's communication.

Rami Nashashibi, a Muslim social activist and founder of the Inner City Muslim Action Network, from the 2002 program "The Problem of Evil":

[Qur'anic verse in Arabic] "Have mercy on that which is on Earth so that which is in heaven can have mercy on you." The fact that that message has been, unfortunately, somewhat either minimized or cynically dismissed becomes very apparent in the harsh realities of our lives — whether they be in the inner cities, in the ghettos of Chicago, or whether they be in the refugee camps of Muslims throughout the world. This aspect of our faith traditions, as a Muslim, I try to fall back on.

Leila Ahmed, an author and a professor at Harvard Divinity School, from the October 2005 program, "Muslim Women and Other Misunderstandings":

Well, look, for one thing, I no longer believe there's an Islamic world, because where exactly are the borders? Are they in Chicago? Where are they? Where does the Islamic world end and where does the West begin? Is it in Paris, or where is it? So I do think what happens in this country is going to be as much about the Islamic world as whatever happens over there. The Islamic world is no longer over there. That's one thing. The other thing is, I think what we do, what we Americans do, will profoundly determine what becomes of what we're calling an Islamic world.